Another fake signature?

bospress.net

www.bospress.net
Hi Mark,
It looks questionable. A bit shaky. That could mean that Buk's hand was tired, or a forger was not as adept as he thought when forging this. The telltale sign would be to look at the reverse. Bad forgers take too much time when signing and leave "starts and stops" that can be viewed as bleeds on the reverse, when in sharpie (or in extra indentations with a ballpoint). Buk would have signed his name too fast for this to happen.

If I was to buy this, I would only pay with Paypal and make sure that it is not coming ot of my funds, but a Credit card. That would afford you two protections, should this turn out to be a fake... If it was me, I would pass (which I will do). Too damn questionable....

The signature is late 80's or early 90's. Certainly not signed in 1979....

Bill
 
the more u look at it, it appears FAKE.
if it were real I'd buy it for $75, and someone probably will...
It's tough to 'enjoy' a purchase like this one, you never know for sure if it's LEGIT, you might have bought a $5 used copy of a book for $75!
PASS.
 

bospress.net

www.bospress.net
does anyone want to e-mail him and ask for a closer scan?

That would let us know if we should buy it or convinve him to shut the auction down....

Bill
 
sounds like you have a GOOD idea but want someone else to do the work for you!!!
:)
It's a good idea and why should WE steal your thunder, ask him!

If he's RELUCTANT, HESITANT, then there's probably a pretty good reason...
 

mjp

Founding member
It could be legit...if the guy had Bukowski sign it on a roller coaster or while he was water skiing. Or maybe he kept punching him in the arm while he was signing. Those things could explain why it looks the way it does.

That, or someone wrote that signature very slowly while looking at a genuine signature.
 

mjp

Founding member
Well, the signature is so jerky it looks like it was started and stopped 20 times. But then again, most forgers would go to greater lengths to make it seem genuine, so it's a tough one. If it's a fake, it's a really bad job.

shakeysignature.jpg
 
I completely agree, started and stopped a number of times; closely check out the C and B (very laboured). Not sure I agree with your point; if it's a fake, it's a really bad job. Cuz it's still not for sure if it's LEGIT or not (probably not), but who is to say. Maybe after BILL emails him we'll know more, or as often is the case, less...
MJP, can u link me to or have a thread showcasing the WORST FAKE BUK SIGNATURE (s) to date??? I'd be curious to see a 'collection' of them over the years (more popping up as of late, with the popularity of BUK growing...)
 

bospress.net

www.bospress.net
Hi,
I just sent him an e-mail. Looking at his other auctions, I see other serious problems. NOT ACCUSING HIM OF ANYTHING, but there are people that buy books and then sign them and sell them as first editions. ... Look at this from this seller. A very poor forgery... John Glenn's signature does NOT look this shaky. Sure he is 85, but he is 85 and can still kick my ass. This signature seals it for me... Something is VERY, VERY wrong...

Bill


If he does not pull the forged Buk signature, then I know that someone on this forum will run this up and then never pay for it.... People seem to not like being fucked with....
 
if u compare the way 'he' signed the 'J' in John, it's similar to 'his' C and B in Bukowski's signature. It's amazing what people will do to make a few (or sometimes a LOT) of bucks... SHAME.
 

HenryChinaski

Founding member
that sig is a total fake. anybody with a fairly decent pair of eyes could tell you that.

p.s. notice how it only went for 75 bucks? some dumbass probably thought OMG this is a steal. well, somebody should tell him he just got ripped off....BIG TIME.
 

bospress.net

www.bospress.net
Hi,
Which one? I was told that The Bukowski book was cancelled by the seller after he was notified about the problems. This is the problem with private auctions. I can understand if it is something sensitive or VERY expensive, but otherwise, they always strike me as shady practice... If someone bought it, they bouight a $5 book and paid $75 for it/....

Bill
 

bospress.net

www.bospress.net
Hi,
unconvincing in what way. Those of us that have hundreds of real ones are pretty comfortable that this is a forgery... hopefully the buyer will get into Bukowski and see this forum and then they can return the book and get their money back...

Bill
 

hoochmonkey9

Art should be its own hammer.
Moderator
Founding member
I think poptop meant the signature is unconvincing, not the questioning of it.
 

Bukfan

"The law is wrong; I am right"
Let's hope the life-lesson is worth the money...:D
 
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HenryChinaski

Founding member
I've seen loads of genuine bukowski signatures and just the way the letters are slanted and all jumbled and so on and so forth. its not hard to tell a fake from the real deal.
 

Rekrab

Usually wrong.
A really good book on a genius forger is THE POET AND THE MURDERER by Simon Worrall. The stuff on the poet he forged -- Emily Dickinson -- (among others) -- is also interesting if you're into her. This guy, Mark Hofmann, was highly talented, very smart, very knowledgeable, and went to great lengths to create undetectible forgeries (physically and content-wise). He even made his own "old" ink by burning the bindings of antique books and getting the soot black from it. The ink carbon date tested as being old. But then he went too far and started making bombs to kill his enemies who were wising up to his crimes. He was a better forger than mad bomber. A great read for rare book/manuscript freaks.
 

mjp

Founding member
Sounds very interesting. There are a ton of copies on eBay, I just bought one for $0.77.
 

jordan

lothario speedwagon
not that I would EVER defraud someone to whom I was selling a book, but I've always found forging signatures to be pretty easy. if you look at a signature and have the discipline to sign the name 1,000 times, you will be able to generate a fake that's way better than the two in this thread (and that awful Fante signature from a different thread).

that being said, Bukowski's is really tough to duplicate, because he writes out almost every letter in his name. The ticket is an author who jumbles a bunch of letters together, since that's fairly easy to sign quickly and without wobbles or starts and stops.

for the record: i don't recommend ever forging a name on anything to defraud anyone (i can't stress that enough). that being said, if this post is inappropriate, pm me and I'll get rid of it.
 

jordan

lothario speedwagon
for sure... my point was more that those are really awful fakes, and that making a passable looking fake isn't that difficult. however, passable clearly dosen't mean unidentifiable, although the low-res pics and veil of anonymity on ebay makes it pretty dangerous for a lot of collectors.
 
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