Marina Louise Bukowski

Olaf

Over 100 posts
#1
Does anyone know much about her?

She is rarely mentioned. She is vague as fog. What is she up too, afterall, she is still alive.

Tell all...tell all...those who can tell! Would love to know everything...her relationship with Charles, her life, her attitude to his work/life/legacy...

Fill me in - I am a sycophant

'In 1964, a daughter, Marina Louise Bukowski, was born to Bukowski and Frances Smith.'


Does anyone know any more? Who was Frances Smith? Why did they never marry? Did Bukowski maintain a relationship with his daughter?

cirerita? zoom man? bospress.net? mjp? EVERYONE?

Anything light you can shed on this area?
 

cirerita

Founding member
Over 1000 posts
#2
B proposed to her, but Frances refused to marry again -she had had a very disappointing marriage previously.

yep, B apparently adored Marina and he expressed so in a few poems, such as "kaakaa and other immolations", "poem for my daughter" or "Marina".
 

Olaf

Over 100 posts
#3
I have read 'kaakaa' and a few other bits and pieces about Marina...Bukowski loved her very much...picked her up from school...did all the fatherly things with love...

I wonder what she is up too. I know it's a bit cheap to wonder about the poets siblings but I am just curious to know if she has followed in her fathers foot steps...does she feature in 'Born into this'?


For a poet and writer with such notoriety I am surprised she has not been interviewed or had a more vocal role...but then again, perhaps that is the last thing she wants.
 

bospress.net

www.bospress.net
Over 5000 posts
#7
Also, Frances Smith was also known as the poet FrancEYE. She is still living. Marina was married with at least one child, but I'm not sure if she is still married or has more children. I know that Buk was alive when she married, though.

I can ask around. I know one person that is very close friends with Frances...

BIll
 

Rekrab

Usually wrong.
Over 1000 posts
#8
Yes, Marina works with computers. She's interviewed with Frances in BORN INTO THIS. I just read someplace that Bukowski left his entire estate to Linda B.; Marina got nothing. Is that true? If so, it seems a bit odd for a father not to leave his only child anything.
 
#9
I thought by law, the childern of an author were entitled to a certain percentage of the royalties. Wasn't that the issue in the Jan Kerouac vs. Sampras family litigation?
 

cirerita

Founding member
Over 1000 posts
#10
in the unpublished letters held at the UCSB, B. first left 1/4 -or thereabouts- of his estate to Linda. This was in the early 80's. Then they were getting along pretty well and he changed his will so Linda would get 1/3 of his estate. Later on -I think in 1983 or 1984- Linda would go into hunger strikes to try to save their relationship. This was a time when they didn't live together much of the time. Then B. changed his will so Linda would 1/4 of his estate only. After a few more hunger strikes, B. decided to finally marry Linda and -oh, surprise- he changed his will AGAIN and left 1/2 -or thereabouts- of his estate to Linda.

I remember reading theses letters and having a good laugh while thinking: "Well, now, that IS hell!"

I can't recall anything at all about how much of his estate would be for Marina.
 

Bukfan

"The law is wrong; I am right"
Over 5000 posts
#11
According to Sounes Buk bio Marina did'nt get anything. Linda B. inherited everything. Can this really be true? It seems an odd thing to do since Buk and Marina had a close relationship. Can anybody shed some light on this?...
 
Last edited by a moderator:

mjp

The stone that the builder refused
Moderator
Founding member
Over 5000 posts
#12
Maybe she didn't want or need any money from her father's estate. Maybe she and her husband made more money than he did, who knows. It's certainly possible in the computer industry in California. You have to wade through seas of millionaires to get to the counter and place an order at Starbucks in some cities.

Then, of course, there are people who are content with their lives as they are, and wouldn't welcome a sudden influx of money or the responsibility of managing an "estate."
 

HenryChinaski

Founding member
Over 1000 posts
#14
as stated previously, Marina bore Buk''s only grandson, Nikhil Henry Bukowski Sahoo, and the poetry collection, Open All Night is dedicated to him.

there's a picture of them together, published in Bukowski In Pictures. I'll see if i can dig it up.

I like this pic: it's from Marina's wedding.
bukowskiatmarinaswedding.jpg
 
M

MULLINAX

#15
Marina is a top-flight engineer. Her grandfather wanted Buk to be an engineer, so he would have been proud. My question is this: Who is the father of Hank's grandson? But did Buk actually hurt his daughter by cutting her completely out of his will? Were other (side) arrangements made? And if Hank did cut her out, out of a sense of malice, did it have anything to do with the father of Marina's child?
 
#16
Hi folks,

John Dullagan mentioned to me that Marina lived in Albany, CA.

My personal feeling is that she is a private person. Additionally, having come from such exceptionally non mainstream parents, she may have selected a life in engineering, not only because of having an aptitude for it, but it would have offered a stability that perhaps she missed as a child. Just my guess.

I, too, heard that Linda inherited the entire estate. When I heard this, I began to realize that her father was not somehow the person I had idolized. That he was a vulnerable human being who was a wonderful writer, but who was capable of hurting even his own daughter. As far as I know, she has never publicly criticized him in any way.
 

mjp

The stone that the builder refused
Moderator
Founding member
Over 5000 posts
#17
My question is this: Who is the father of Hank's grandson?
And if Hank did cut her out, out of a sense of malice, did it have anything to do with the father of Marina's child?
Well, since you seem to think he was a Nazi, then it stands to reason that you would also think that Bukowski would have been opposed to his daughter marrying someone from India, right?

You should grow a pair of balls and come out and say what you believe rather than hinting around and waiting for someone else to say it for you.
 

bospress.net

www.bospress.net
Over 5000 posts
#18
The child's last hame is "Sohoo", if I remember correctly. Maybe I'm a bit off, but I think that I'm at least close.

All best,
Bill
 
#19
When I heard this, I began to realize that her father was not somehow the person I had idolized. That he was a vulnerable human being who was a wonderful writer, but who was capable of hurting even his own daughter. As far as I know, she has never publicly criticized him in any way.
Just to back up for a moment, and I think I have said this before, but the way the law used to be written, and I think this would have been applicable at the time of Bukowski's death, the children of an author are entitled to 50% of all that author's future roaylties after the author's death. This was the main issue when Jan Kerouac sued the Sampras family(the first time) over Jack Kerouac's estate. So if BUK knew that Marina was going to be getting 50% of his royalties for the rest of her life,(royalties which he knew were growing quite steadily at the time of his death), his overall concern may have been more for Linda's future.

Secondly, we are all working on the assumption that having an estate left to you equals good fortune. I do want to suggest that managing an estate for anyone is no small commitment or cost, let alone an author or an author like BUK who continues to grow in popularity. It might very well be that Marina, who is rumored to be a private person, didn't want the additional headache and responsiblity of managing her father's estate, which would have become as it has for Linda, a full time job.

No real way for us to know here, but you never can tell...maybe one day Marina will drop by this site and put her two cents in. ;)
 

mjp

The stone that the builder refused
Moderator
Founding member
Over 5000 posts
#20
It could be that two aerospace engineers don't need any additional income from an estate. It could also be that this Bukowski estate is not making anyone rich. It could be that a good real estate agent in Los Angeles makes more money every year than Bukowski's estate generates (I believe there's an old thread around here with some earnings for one year taken from Bukowski's papers and notes and it is a good amount of money, but not a huge sum).

There are a lot of things at work here, a lot of business and family dynamics that we will never know.
 
#21
Oh, goodness, I don't think in this case it is about the money. My sincere hope is that you'all are correct in that some arrangement was made for Marina so that she does not feel the sting of rejection from her father.
Emotionally, that would be quite tough. no matter how you look at it.
 

mjp

The stone that the builder refused
Moderator
Founding member
Over 5000 posts
#22
Marina and her son (and her mother) were at the Huntington celebration last year, and she still visits Linda in San Pedro, so it wouldn't appear that there was any "rejection," as you characterized it.

I don't think we can speculate about either the contents of Bukowski's will or how Marina felt about it. To say he was mean to her or acted with malice is quite a leap.
 
#23
For sure, what do any of us know about this? Assuming that the rumors are true or false is not a proper reaction on my part. And, it is none 'o my business! I just felt TERRIBLE when I heard that nothing was left for Marina. Probably something in my own life that would make me get an instant stomach ache upon hearing that. Now I will put that judgment away.
 

Bukfan

"The law is wrong; I am right"
Over 5000 posts
#24
The child's last hame is "Sohoo", if I remember correctly. Maybe I'm a bit off, but I think that I'm at least close.
You're very close, Bill! - The childs full name is Nikhil Henry Bukowski Sahoo...
 
Last edited by a moderator:

bospress.net

www.bospress.net
Over 5000 posts
#25
How old would he be now? I saw a picture of him a few years ago, but as time has passed, I am not sure how old he would be.

Hell, with kids (expecially ones with engineers for parents) the way they are, it is not a longshot that we hear from him on this forum....

Bill
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Bukfan

"The law is wrong; I am right"
Over 5000 posts
#26
According to Sounes, little Nikhil was born in juli 1997. So now he's almost 10 years old!
He should be old enough to handle a keyboard, so we could be hearing from him any day now...:D
 
Last edited by a moderator:

mjp

The stone that the builder refused
Moderator
Founding member
Over 5000 posts
#27
How old would he be now? I saw a picture of him a few years ago, but as time has passed, I am not sure how old he would be.
Born in '97, though I'm not sure of the date. So he's around 10 years old.
 
#28
Marina and her son (and her mother) were at the Huntington celebration last year, and she still visits Linda in San Pedro, so it wouldn't appear that there was any "rejection," as you characterized it.

I don't think we can speculate about either the contents of Bukowski's will or how Marina felt about it. To say he was mean to her or acted with malice is quite a leap.
All night, for some reason, I kept thinking about this thread. Wondering about the tone of it. Wondering why my immediate response to the rumour was so emotional. Why I made such a leap as you described. Hopefully different viewpoints are acceptable here even if they are based on emotions rather than logic.

My conclusion, while thinking in the night, down here in Mexico at my daughter's house, is that I based my reaction on my own maternal instincts. No one is more important to me than my three children. No one. When I heard the rumour that Marina was left nothing, I just personalized it right away. It was incomprehensible to me. I was married this January to a dear man. I love, if not adore him. But, he knows that what little I have will go to my children. He just retired as a Managing Editor of an evening t.v. news program. He has his own abilitiy to live o.k. without me, financially. That feels good to me. But the message I want to leave my children is that, "my darlings, I brought you into this world, it is a tough world, and I want to help you even though I am gone. You have given me the greatest love of anyone. I will always love you so much."

So, that's the terrible leap I made. I thought he had left out Marina. I'm really sorry for that leap. It was based on the above, perhaps primitive, maternal instincts.

Respectfully, Amber
 

Bukfan

"The law is wrong; I am right"
Over 5000 posts
#29
So, that's the terrible leap I made. I thought he had left out Marina. I'm really sorry for that leap. It was based on the above, perhaps primitive, maternal instincts.
Amber, there's nothing wrong with having maternal instincts. - On the contrary! We all know you meant well...
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Top