Phony manuscript

Bukfan

"The law is wrong; I am right"
I think you're right, mjp! The seller writes:

" The price of this work is under because I do not have certificate of the same one. So I left to the judgement of the experts and eridites the verification of this."

It seems like he knows that it's not genuine. And the signature looks too neat, especially "Bukowski". The "Charles" might pass for genuine. Then again, I'm no expert on Buk signatures. However, the way he presents the manuscript triggers my alarm bell...
 
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hoochmonkey9

Art should be its own hammer.
Moderator
Founding member
And the signature looks too neat, especially "Bukowski". The "Charles" might pass for genuine.

I was thinking the exact same thing, though I'm far from an expert on sigs, having only 2 in my hot little hands, but I've drooled over other real ones for long enough to know this ain't one.
 

hank solo

Just practicin' steps and keepin' outta the fights
Moderator
Founding member
Well the lettering looks wrong to my eyes. Compared to something like Dear Mr Bukowski or The Day It Snowed In L.A. which are both printed in Bukowski's hand written style (isn't that called his holograph?)
 

Bukfan

"The law is wrong; I am right"
Yes, a persons own handwriting is called holograph.

So you've compared Buk's hand written style to the "manuscript" on Ebay. If they're not the same then the "manuscript" must be a fake!
 
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mjp

Founding member
They are not close to being the same. Nor are the drawings or signature.

Saying you have no provenance or documentation is fine, but tacking a high price on it and listing it as a Bukowski manuscript (no disclaimer in the auction title) is bullsheet. He knows it's not genuine, that's why the disclaimer is in the description. If he doesn't know for sure but still has doubts, he should start it at $1 and let someone buy it as a curiosity.
 

Bukfan

"The law is wrong; I am right"
I've taken a look at his feedback. It seems like most of his sales are cheap postcards. Strange place for a Buk manuscript to show up (a postcard seller in Argentina). Too bad it's possible to get away with selling fakes at Ebay...
 
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mjp

Founding member
No, and I just about shit when I saw the preview image of that manuscript, hoping it was real...heh.
 

bospress.net

www.bospress.net
he closed the auction. Seems that there were a few of us that let him know that this is 100% fake and he decided that it would be dishonest to sell it knowing so certainly that it is fake.

Of course, it could always show up again on ebay. If so, we'll see it, of course.

bIll
 

Bukfan

"The law is wrong; I am right"
seen a holograph Bukowski poem (not an aphorism)?

The only one I've seen is the one on the inside cover of Beatscene's Bukowski Special issue (March 2004). It's The Tragedy Of The Leaves (with a Buk drawing)...
 
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mjp

Founding member
I haven't seen that issue of Beat Scene, but that is probably taken from It Catches My Heart In Its Hands. There are four illustrated holographs in there (including Tragedy of the Leaves), which he did specifically for the book.

A hand written poem manuscript that wasn't done for some specific purpose - but because his typewriter was in the shop or something - would be a very rare and valuable piece of paper.
 

Bukfan

"The law is wrong; I am right"
I haven't seen that issue of Beat Scene, but that is probably taken from It Catches My Heart In Its Hands. There are four illustrated holographs in there (including Tragedy of the Leaves), which he did specifically for the book.

Aha! So that's where Beatscene got it from! I was wondering about that. Thanks, mjp...
 
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mjp

Founding member
I'll have Carol scan that page of It Catches and post it here so you can compare. But I'm pretty sure that's what Beat Scene used.
 

mjp

Founding member
tragedy.jpg
 

Domator

Founding member
From BS

So the only difference is color.
(Sorry for quality but i took this photo by mobile phone, i don't have scanner and my camera is away)
 

Bukfan

"The law is wrong; I am right"
Thanks for the scans, mjp and Domator! - Yes, that's the exact same one as in the Beatscene Buk Special from 2004! I'm glad we could clear that up.

I have another question about "It Catches...". Is the book made exacly like "Crucifix..." ? With the first 10 pages in different colors and the same book size? And does it open in the same way with 2 "flaps"? And all pages cut like in "Crucifix..."?
 
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