The Last Straw 'vs' Hostage (1 Viewer)

yeah, I thought so.

still it's strange, that the cats who did Hostage would change the order and then put it all together again into one single track instead of having usable marks on the CD.

I think the one-track-CD only makes sense, if you have the recording like that and r too lazy to split into sequences - but to take the work in changing orders and THEN glue it all together again sounds stupid.

Any ideas? Anyone here from the guys who produced the CD?

or AM I wrong and the order is identical? have to compare it this weekend I guess.
 
Denny Bruce produced the Hostage CD. Next time I talk with him, I'll ask him about it.

Keep in mind that there are three poems edited out of Last Straw, just as there are three poems edited out of Riot. That way both DVDs are unique.

I think hostage has more poems than three edited out - but I'm not sure. It would be good to know the exact track list.
 

mjp

Founding member
Editing the readings to avoid duplicating three poems was kind of unnecessary if you ask me. To me the reading of the poems is secondary. 90% of the time Bukowski reads a poem it sucks, and it sucks even worse at the the live readings. It is much more powerful to read his best work to yourself. But that's just my opinion.

What is valuable here is a glimpse into the process and the step back into time.

Here's a drinking game for you: put on either DVD and take a shot every time Bukowski looks at his watch.

He hated doing the readings and the fact that we can watch him do something he so obviously would rather not do is valuable in and of itself. It's like watching him sort mail or something. I don't see any joy in those readings, and I didn't expect to. He was hostile because he was unhappy.
 

1fsh2fsh

I think that I think too much
Founding member
It is much more powerful to read his best work to yourself. But that's just my opinion.

I read his stuff for years (and years) before I heard him read. when I first heard him I was actually disapointed. his voice was nothing like I imagined it to be,( I really don't know what I expected) and then some of the poems were actually changed in my mind. kind of like watching a movie after reading a book. over time I have come to accecpt this. after all it is his own work and I guess that he reads them the way that he wrote them. still I like the way that I interped them better. somehow I think that that is the way that Bukowski intended it to be. like he said many times " I only read for the rent"
 

1fsh2fsh

I think that I think too much
Founding member
I've just re-read my above post (call it boredom) I didn't mean to say that I was disapointed with Bukowski's voice. I haven't the right to. actually I've come to love his voice, the way that he draaawwwlllsss out his words (sheeeiiit maaaannn) it just wasn't what I expected him to sound like. you know, kinda like Mike Tyson. jeez, sometimes I'm such an ass......
 
90% of the time Bukowski reads a poem it sucks, and it sucks even worse at the the live readings.
i don't agree in ANY way!
I DO LOVE him reading his poetry and did from the start!

Maybe no-native-speakers have a different view here:
We usually start reading translations (and are aware that they ARE only translations, no matter how good).
THEN we read the originals - and they are even better. Wow! We start to get deeper into the 'original' thing, into the author.
and THEN we first hear/see HIM speak or read his poems himself - this takes us even more close to the roots...
(and since we were prepared to find something else than the translations we read in the first place offered, maybe because of that, we didn't have that feeling, that some of you native-speakers describe when first hearing/seeing him.)

Anyway - I love the way he reads and talks. And it has influenced my own way of reading his poetry.

(mjp: untouched by this statement is what you stressed - that he did not like giving these readings, that he looks at his watch remarkably often, that it seems to be just another job for him [at one point he even states that].)

ps:
oh, btw - haven't worked on comparing the track-lists this weekend. Did anybody?
 

mjp

Founding member
i don't agree in ANY way!
I DO LOVE him reading his poetry and did from the start!
It's just a personal thing for me. Hearing people read poetry bores me, and if they sound bored, then I really start to think, "Hey, neither of us wants to hear this. What the hell?"

And to me - with a few notable exceptions (that crazy track on the KPFK disc comes to mind) Bukowski sounds bored reading his poems.
 
I'm old school in regards to hearing poets read their works. I want that voice in my head, that physical presence coming across to me, carrying the words. I first "heard" Buk read in 1971 or '72 on a radio program by accident. I'd left the radio alarm clock armed on a Saturday or Sunday morning and was jolted awake at 7:00 a.m. by Bukowski talking about horse races, hookers and poems. I remember just lying there in bed, smoking my first cigarette and listening to him read a short poem or two, wondering, Who the hell is this guy? A couple years later the name BUKOWSKI jumped off the spine of the City Lights edition of Notes of a Dirty Old Man, and I remembered that voice coming out of the radio that morning.
 
Happy to be here, Hoochmonkey9.

It seems odd to me that Buk was so unnerved by reading his work in public, because he was very good at it. Even in the Bellview reading, where he is visibly less sure of himself as a presence, his reading is quite strong. He had great comic delivery.
 
I agree there was no reason to edit the videos to make them unique -- we want everything don't we? The duplicate poems are even more valuable to the listeners like me who like to compare the versions. And about the CD's and poetry reading, man, I LOVE my Bukowski CD's and I have them all. I listen to them over and over, sometimes I talk along with them like singing along with a music CD. The funny parts just get funnier and funnier, and the tough parts don't lose their edge. I can't separate the man from the poems, and the poems wouldn't be nearly the same for me without the live readings.
 

Bukfan

"The law is wrong; I am right"
the poems wouldn't be nearly the same for me without the live readings.

I think most of us can agree on that. There's a big difference between reading the poems and hear Buk reading them. After having heard Buk's readings, you have the sound of his voice in your head every time you read some of his poems...
 
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I have to interject my opinon here. Well, I certainly don't have to, but I will, even if it is contrary.

I think I enjoy Buk's readings as much as he professed to. Don't get me wrong; he's the best writer I've ever read, but his readings have done absolutely nothing to enhance his work for me. Of course, I don't have them all, so perhaps a recommendation or two might change my mind.

So, I'm cool with y'all liking his readings, and I have no bad words about that. I just don't care for it. He speaks to me from the page, and like no other.
 

Bukfan

"The law is wrong; I am right"
perhaps a recommendation or two might change my mind.

Try and listen to his reading of "Firestation" on the 2CD set, "At Terror Street and Agony Way", or his reading of "The Rat" on the CD, "Poems and Insults". There's also some good stuff on the 2CD, "Uncensored". If none of those CD's does anything for you, then I rest my case...
 
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