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Odd Description of Provenance on Poem (1 Viewer)

bospress.net

bospress.net

www.bospress.net
Hi,
I don't think that there will be much interest in a one page poem at $650, but what interests me is the description.

http://cgi.ebay.com/CHARLES-BUKOWSK...286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66:2|65:10|39:1|240:1318

Did Buk send a copy of each poem to his attorney? I REALLY doubt it. Also, was Applebaum representing him in 1973? I doubt it.

Is this all fanciful provenance?

I have no doubt that the poem and signature is real. It certainly is authentic. What I'm getting at is that the provenance seems tailored to be iron clad. I just don't believe the story.

... or, does this explain where all of the signed poems actually come from?

Here is the part in question:

"I obtained this poem apx. 15 years ago, directly from the dealer charged with liquidating the estate of (the Bukowski related items belonging to) Arthur Applebaum, Charles Bukowski's long time attorney and close friend, after Applebaum's passing.

When submitting a poem or short story to a publication, it was Bukowski's habit to type the manuscript with a carbon sheet between 2 pages of paper, thus creating the original and a single carbon copy. Bukowski would then sign and date the original, send that original to his lawyer, Arthur Applebaum, (to legally protect his work) and then send off the carbon copy to the publication for consideration. "
 
Interesting, Bill.
I have no answers but when I read the description
I was looking for my february sunglasses.
The seller has no any feel for design.
 
bospress.net said:
Bukowski would then sign and date the original, send that original to his lawyer, Arthur Applebaum, (to legally protect his work) and then send off the carbon copy to the publication for consideration.
Click to expand...
That is, as the kids say, bullsheet. It makes no logical sense, that story. It sounds like it was written by someone who believes mailing song lyrics to yourself proves that you wrote them. Every creative work is protected by copyright automatically. You do not have to register each (or any) work with the copyright office. The costs to do so would be ridiculous anyway.

If Applebaum had the original typescript of every poem Bukowski wrote - since 1973 - the selling of his collection would have been known to many, many (many) people, and created quite a stir in our little world.
 
Looking at that again, I would also question whether it is an original typescript. I have only seen one post-1960's original typescript sold on eBay (and it was listed and sold as a carbon, Scott didn't realize it was an original until he was preparing it for shipping). That typescript has a much different look than the poem in the auction. Much more crisp and obviously first generation (you can see a closeup view of a few lines at the top of the manuscripts page). The auction images aren't terribly large, but it looks just like the other 1500 or so carbons we've seen.

If it was original I think it would be well worth the opening bid (and more), based on rarity alone. Put it this way, if I thought it was original I'd be going after it, even though I'm pretty deep in an ABSOLUTELY NO BUYING! financial hole at the moment. But for my own purposes I'm convinced it's a carbon. The only way to know for sure would be to see it in person, of course, but it sure doesn't appear to be original. I suppose if someone here buys it we may get a chance to find out.
 
A few things raised my eyebrow:

1. Does the paper crinkle like normal paper, or like carbon (and is there a sheen; does that matter)?
2. The folds seem awkward "” not with the normal crease of paper (feathering with age).
3. The ink signature, while probably real, doesn't seem to adhere like it would to "paper," almost as if the surface is rejecting it. (Could be a lousy ball-point pen.)

Having no forensic experience related to this, I don't have a clue.

And, I've never typed on carbon (in the last 25 years); so maybe I've helped validate the piece, or not...

Just some observations...

Pax
 
Last edited by a moderator:
homeless mind said:
1. Does the paper crinkle like normal paper, or like carbon (and is there a sheen; does that matter)?
2. The folds seem awkward "” not with the normal crease of paper (feathering with age).
3. The ink signature, while probably real, doesn't seem to adhere like it would to "paper," almost as if the surface is rejecting it. (Could be a lousy ball-point pen.)
Click to expand...

Carbon paper goes between two sheets of regular paper. A carbon copy is on regular paper with the type transferred via the carbon paper.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Wow well, someone bought it... Hopefully it was someone here (I think I know who ;)) if so... hopefully we can get some details.

And if it was someone here... thank you. You saved me from spending money I don't really have.
 
Well it shows c***c, so... I've got a guess. Unless they really hide who it is and don't show the name at all, I could be wrong. It happens rather often.
 
marina del rey said:
I believe [eBay] completely changes the letters.
Click to expand...
That's right. When they first started masking the names they left the actual first and last character, but for some time now it appears to be random.

LickTheStar said:
Does he ever take a break?
Click to expand...
If you had a big pile of disposable income, would you?

We'll never get a close look at it now, but I think it's safe to say, based on those images, that it is a carbon.
 
I've never collected the individual poems, signed, per se. Are they a good investment? I have always focused on books with paintings, or numbered, signed, etc.
 
bospress.net said:
it was stnickl. If you check his purchases, it comes up.
Click to expand...
Speaking of "Saint" Nick Lawrence, I was looking through his feedback today to see if he was the buyer of something (not much Bukowski lately, but lots and lots of softcore Japanese nudie books), and saw that Scott at Abandoned Planet was threatening to block him late last year after a lot of unpaid auctions:

- Champion, GREAT Bukowski customer but pure hell when it comes to paying

- 55 days and STILL waiting for payment on this item. Otherwise a great customer

- Sadly I am at my limit and probably must 86 this major Bukowski buyer

- This MAJOR buyer won 76 BUK auctions Nov 2 and today Dec 27th has paid for NONE

Sounds familiar.
 

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