Yet another idiot blabbering about Bukowski (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter mjp
- Start date
Great interview...
HenryChinaski
Founding member
good interview mjp.
number6horse
okyoutwopixiesoutyougo
Thanks for bumping this. I had missed this until now.
Rekrab
Usually wrong.
A fine interview, mjp. You set them straight. This part is dead on:
"I don't see him as a bigot because he was not intolerant on those levels. He was intolerant of people as humans, but not because of their sexual leanings or race. This is a sticky subject to sort out, again, because of when he was born. It is difficult for us to understand how many prejudices were taken for granted in the early part of the twentieth century. Most people didn't question these things until the civil rights movement in the 60's. Not to dismiss prejudice, but it is important to put it in context. I'm sure many of us have parents or grandparents who say things that make us cringe. They are not necessarily intolerant, they just came from an ignorant generation."
I'm old enough to have seen this first hand. When I was a kid, it was perfectly normal for whites to ridicule, dismiss, distain, and insult minorities. It was almost never questioned by anyone. Otherwise good, kind, loving, generous, decent and fair people used the "n word", and worse. It happened because nobody gave it a second thought. In the 60s, young people turned away from this kind of prejudice, but most older people held onto it, although they may have been more discreet about expressing it. Bukowski's "racist" statements are far more liberal than stuff I heard every day as a kid.
"I don't see him as a bigot because he was not intolerant on those levels. He was intolerant of people as humans, but not because of their sexual leanings or race. This is a sticky subject to sort out, again, because of when he was born. It is difficult for us to understand how many prejudices were taken for granted in the early part of the twentieth century. Most people didn't question these things until the civil rights movement in the 60's. Not to dismiss prejudice, but it is important to put it in context. I'm sure many of us have parents or grandparents who say things that make us cringe. They are not necessarily intolerant, they just came from an ignorant generation."
I'm old enough to have seen this first hand. When I was a kid, it was perfectly normal for whites to ridicule, dismiss, distain, and insult minorities. It was almost never questioned by anyone. Otherwise good, kind, loving, generous, decent and fair people used the "n word", and worse. It happened because nobody gave it a second thought. In the 60s, young people turned away from this kind of prejudice, but most older people held onto it, although they may have been more discreet about expressing it. Bukowski's "racist" statements are far more liberal than stuff I heard every day as a kid.
Black Swan
Abord the Yorikke!
Thanks for reviving this thread. Good answers.
I apologize but I haven't gotten through the entire interview yet... AH WHY BOTHER? (with the interview and my indisposition(?) on this particular comment) But I will!
Bukowski's "racist" statements... I've read quite a lot of Bukowski and as close as I've come to find him expressing the least bit of racism, if it is racism at all is when he refers to African Americans as "the blacks".
Now I sometimes find myself sometimes using the phrase "the blacks" but I try to correct myself feeling uncomfortable using that phrase, so I'll say " black people" or "colored people".
All and all we are colored.
SORRY I did not finish the interview, too much going on around me at the moment and something like MJP said about "babbling".
*EDIT* Yes I am familiar that referring to African Americans as "blacks" was quite common in those days.
bospress.net
www.bospress.net
Yeah, he did threaten people with his "Jewish Lawyer", including the infamous couch scene. It seems that it all depends really on the intent. Eminem can say the N word and people know that he is not using it the same way as a klan member, so it is accepted. My Grandfather was a jew. When I worked for Greeks a few years ago, they would introduce me to people (including, strangely enough to clients) as "my little jew." It was just their way. They said what they thought. They were convinced that because I had a jewish grandfather, I was a jew. It was more of a playful thing. I guess if Bukowski only said it behind their back, it would be different. I would be pissed if I found out that people were making fun of me behind my back, but have no problem with people that want to bust my chops to my face.
Buk had close friends that were gay, jewish, etc. Not a lot of black friends, that I know of, though.
Bill
Buk had close friends that were gay, jewish, etc. Not a lot of black friends, that I know of, though.
Bill
mjp
Founding member
Yes, it's long, and it's old and I didn't ask you to read it.
But maybe you should have, then you would have seen that the question was, "One could argue that Bukowski's writing reflects hostility toward women and homosexuals. Some critics slam him as a sexist and a bigot. What is your opinion?"
The question and my answer had nothing to do with racism.
