America in Panic - Michael Jackson dead (1 Viewer)


Strangegirl - Do you think your recording instructor made that prediction based more on the artistic value of the demos or the high-profile names involved ?

When I heard that Eddie Van Halen contributed a solo, my thought was that it was a decision made at a power lunch at Spago. "Hot rock guitarist and top R&B performer TOGETHER ! IT'S GOLD, BABY ! "
Oh I am sure it had to do with how the business of music was at that time. The music was really well produced... well as far as the Music industry was concerned. It was polish and sheeen and yeah the people involved added to the high gloss finish. I was learning about the music business at the time. Back then and even now if I like something there you have it. But i think he was definitely trying to make a point to us and to see the bigger picture of the "Biz" of the Music. I am sure there was a Buzz going in the inner circle of the industry. They had a lot riding on this and a lot behind them. Remember this is 1982, MTV is just in it's infancy. This was made for this time.
I remember thinking that what i had heard was okay, you know it wasn't the worst thing i had heard. What he (my teacher) was telling us was, this is what the Music Industry is listening to right now and this is what is going to make them scream and if you want to work in the Music Biz and you want to be big time... you need to know this...
Needless to say I opted to go work for and avant gard SF rock Band. Made no money did lots of drugs had a great time... sometimes... got seriously burned out and then decided i wanted to be a sound editor for films...
This is a great country where a poor young black boy can grow up to be a rich old white lady.

I believe it will come out as a murder suicide-Jackson killed Farrah and then killed himself.


I think that I think too much
Founding member
I'm just waiting to see if Janet Jackson shows up at the funeral. I've surmised for a long time that these two may be the same person....
Does anyone remember the performance he did; it was either the Emmys or the Superbowl, when they brought out hundreds of little kids to surround him? It was like a 'children of the world' theme or something. It was unbelieveable to me then and it is the same today. He was allowed to abuse children and get away with it because of money and fame. He flaunted it in people's/the puplic's faces for years,and the one's closest to him chose to turn away from it and not do a thing to stop him.
It is a horrible world when people like him are loose to do what they want. And I think there is many a child, his own included, that are now in a much safer situation with him out of the mix. I'm glad he's gone. CRB:)

Without making excuses about him twisting off later in life, I think MJ was a product of a cruel, relentless Showbiz parents...which explains quite a bit about him. He was also pretty darn famous for, what 40+ years?...& we all know that the world treats famous people much, much differently. Fame is it's own brand of insanity when it comes to what it teaches...& he was famous when he was 7 or 8 years old. I can't even imagine how lonely it would be to have screaming hordes following you everywhere, everyday, all the time...

He made some world-class pop music...that is undeniable. To accomplish the things he accomplished in music is nothing short of amazing. Professionally he was a real talent; in his personal life, from age 8, he never had a chance at normalcy. All of which fed into him ruining many lives...his own among them. Anything sinister he did to kids is unforgivable--&, despite his professional accomplishments, have really come to define him.

Talk about a life that saw unimaginable highs and lows...
Did M.J. molest little children? I don't know.

Would it have been hard to accuse him of pedophilia? No.

Would it of been beneficial for certain parties to acuse him of child molestation? Hell yeah.

Was he a genius? Yes.

Did he write "good" music? No.

Did he write good pop music? Hell yeah.
It's all up to opinion whether he molested but I have to give him the benefit of the doubt, keep in mind most molesters do anything not to bring attention to themselves and usually give off an image of macho guy next door not Peter Pan guy weirdo. Besides he always came off as a gentle guy and it's hard for me to believe he'd go from that to a man who would harm a cancer victim child. I believe one family has a history of shaking down celebs. And I don't see him as a stupid person just a naive one and arrogant about what society would think of his actions.

I feel very sorry for him, but if he did molest, not a bit.


Founding member
Besides he always came off as a gentle guy and it's hard for me to believe he'd go from that to a man who would harm a cancer victim child.
Maybe he didn't see it as harming them. But I don't really care what the guy sticking a knife into me thinks, I'm more concerned with the effect his "feelings" are having on me.

Sorry, one - or even two - people conspiring against poor Michael can be explained away, but not the more than half a dozen who have accused him. Two of them brought it all the way to trial, and Jackson settled one of those cases privately. Why? Would you settle a case like that if you were innocent? I wouldn't. I would spend every penny I had defending myself. So would you. So would anyone who is innocent.

And Jackson had the (much) bigger hammer in those cases. He could have easily paid 10 lawyers to drag it out until the accusers couldn't afford to carry on and dropped the suits. Instead, the guy holding all the cards folded. He folded rather than go through with the trial that would have exposed details about his overall creepiness and the specific methods he used to prey on children.

What sort of mass hypnosis is the world under to hail that piece of shit as a genius? If he was just Mike Jackson who worked at the hardware store and not famous the famous man-child of Motown he would be run out of every town he tried to move to (and he would always move to the house right across the street from the elementary school, where his type lives). To say any music he wrote or performed is anything other than polished, utterly disposable pop is kind of delusional. The only trail he blazed was to the playground.

The Emperor has no clothes! (And your kid is right next to him on the bed. Why aren't you angry?)

Gerard K H Love

Appreciate your friends
Hey I just heard Al Sharpton is in town, at the request of the Jackson family, to speak at the funeral an as he says, "clear Michael Jackson's name". That is one tall order. How many times have you seen Michael Jackson standing, sitting, walking or holding a young boy with a blurred out face? How in the world is the great not so sharp Reverend going to clear all of that up?
I liked a lot of his music, but they have been talking about him paying off kids since the early 80s.
One last thing: Does the Black Entertainment Television know that Michael Jackson hasn't been black for over 25 years?

d gray

tried to do his best but could not
Founding member
nice wrap-up. can we lock this thread now? i'm sick of this guy.

oh yeah, what's brown and smells and is found in little boys underwear?
MJP you may be right but it doesn't add up to me & I'm really not a fan of his music just a fan of crime cases -and if I had that much money I would probably pay someone off to avoid the unpleasantness of a trial. And that trial against him was flimsy from what I saw and I was unsurprised he was acquitted. Again I don't think anyone can say conclusively by the evidence.


Founding member
I guess I just don't see how the trial would be "unpleasant" if you had the truth on your side. Seems more like a chance for vindication. But what do I know, no one has ever accused me of drugging (or jesus-juicing) and molesting their children.

But let's say we take away all the squirmy, unpleasant kiddie stuff and assume that it is normal for a man to have an amusement park for a home, and have sleepovers with young boys (no parents, thank you), and just deal with Jackson's music. The genius tag is still undeserved. He did nothing, ever, that demonstrated or even hinted at any sort of musical genius. It's expensive follower-pop.

It's easy to lose perspective after almost 30 years, but when Thriller came out, all we could say was, "Well, someone has been listening to Prince." His influence was all over that record. Jackson absorbed what was going on, just like a lot of singers do (David Byrne, David Bowie and Paul Simon come to mind as others who would have trouble releasing new records if some other musical source wasn't "inspiring" them).

Judge Jackson on the songs alone and there's nothing there but some craftsmanship and expensive recordings. I can't find any genius there. Compare him to any number of really good songwriters. He doesn't stand up.
Oh, I totally agree about the music, I might like a few tunes but give me the Jackson 5 everyday and I think both him and Prince owe a whole lot to James Brown. When you think about it Michael and Prince added a lot of white elements to their music making it more acceptable for white audiences while Brown's was very black. I think of MJ (not MJP) a lot like Madonna as they were both better dances than singers and became sucessful during the MTV era when visuality took precedence over music.

Still you can't make judgements about him based on his music, it's true he did a lot to help children out and it's true this is all cancelled out if he molested even one. But someone like Gary Glitter kept it all under wraps and only got discovered through a computer he had fixed (he must of been unaware of what computers do) he never opened a camp and he follows the more typical scenario for a molester.
I probably have a differnt idea of what a genius is than alot of people. I think that people who are super good at sports can be geniuses( not the ones who are physically built perfect for their sport like the fishman AKA M. Phelps or shaq but people like M.Ali or Wayne Gretzky). The main reason I would consider M.J. a genius would be his dance moves. Also the way he suffered all these allegations of child molestation and still managed to hold on to legions of devoted fans, by coming off as just so innocent and childlike. That takes a very sharp mind. He handled his fans better than anyone I can think of. He was also very good at handleing the media and holding his title of the king of pop for so LONG. But basically it was his dance moves. I've never seen anyone dance like him, and that is something. There are so many people conditioned to dance from a young age, but there has never been anyone like M.J. Plus anyone who would go on T.V. and say that there is nothing more loving than sharing a bed with a young boy, amidst all the controversy, and still manage to not go to prison has to be a genius:)
Dancing has alot to do with music. I used to work at a country club that hosted alot of banquets, and it didn't seem like ANYONE was dancing without music. I definetly agree he was not a musical genius, but I think his dancing qualifies him as a genius in some sense of the word.


lothario speedwagon
it occurred to me a couple nights ago that i know more of the words to "fat" (by weird al) than i do to "bad." in fact, i think weird al is more deserving of the "genius" tag... MJ never did anything approaching the organic amazingness of UHF.
Not as good as Prince, eh, mjp? (For example...)

Oh, and I do agree; if it's danceable, it's probably not worth listening to. Except for Darling Dear, which has one of Jamerson's most ridiculously crazy bass parts. I can't stop listening to THAT.

How many good Beatles or Dylan tunes are danceable?
My Daughter heard about his death. Then tonight we were watching TV and they showed a quick photo of him and my 9 year old daughter asked "Who is that woman?" I shit you not. It was PRICELESS. I had to explain that he used to be a normal looking enough man before he started doing strange things to himself.

I'm not sure about the music or dancing, but that NOSE was fucking genius. You HAVE to be a genius to make yourself look that odd. Had he lived longer, maybe he would have removed it entirely. What a joke.

Here's one for you. I HATE Micheal Jackson, he is/was a child molester. He has/did rape children for years. He can/did dance and sing his ass off until the cows came home... BUT He is still/was a childlmolesting FREAK> I don't care how BAD his childhood existence was... LEAVE CHILDREN ALONE> When you have money like MJ had Money$$ you can buy any freaky-wild-sex shit you want. The second you start fucking around with little KIDS... well There IS something wrong. SING. DANCE. JAM. MAKEALLKINDSOFMONEY$$$$ LEAVE THE CHILDREN BE>.
Before it was announced that he died I was offered to imitate him and do the tour in his place, it was all supposed to be a secret.

I am now regretting I turned this offer down.
I agree with CRBSMILE - I'm glad that wannabe whity supremacist in bling bling
SS-uniform with brassard is motherfucking DEAD. Hey I can hear his new song:"Because I'm dead, I'm dead, you know it!".

The bastard had the nerves to sing:"We are the world, we are the children, we are the ones to make a better day, so let's start giving."
Give what? His boner up a young boy's ass? What a nice gift, Michael Jackson.

Rot in hell.


Founding member
Dancing has alot to do with music.

Not as good as Prince, eh, mjp? (For example...)

Oh, and I do agree; if it's danceable, it's probably not worth listening to. Except for Darling Dear, which has one of Jamerson's most ridiculously crazy bass parts. I can't stop listening to THAT.

How many good Beatles or Dylan tunes are danceable?
Pardon me for not dumbing down my comment. Here, try this: The ability of a performer to dance has nothing to do with musical talent.

Is that more clear? I wasn't commenting on the "danceability" of the music.

As for "not as good as Prince" - as a musician, no. That's laughable. Jackson was not in the same league. And that is indisputable, whether you like Prince or think he's too wet. But while we're on the subject, dismissing Prince because of his guitar sound on some songs is like saying The Beatles sucked because Ringo couldn't sing. It's a very small part of the whole.

As a dancer, Jackson was no doubt better than Prince. But I don't rate musicians on their dancing ability.

Gerard K H Love

Appreciate your friends
Here's one for you. I HATE Micheal Jackson, he is/was a child molester. He has/did rape children for years. ..... ....snip...

I agree with CRBSMILE - I'm glad that wannabe whity supremacist in bling bling
The bastard had the nerves to sing:"We are the world, we are the children, we are the ones to make a better day, so let's start giving."
Give what? His boner up a young boy's ass? What a nice gift, Michael Jackson.

Easy now. and Potox Don't ask me why I know this but MJ preferred to perform fellatio on those little boys. He liked to teach them how to french kiss at his little slumber parties.
"Would you care for some more Jesus juice, Macaulay?"


This guy needs to come clean and talk.
Why stay easy? I didn't like his music in the first place and what's happening now is that people who were/are into his music talk about the loss of a great artist and blabla about his violent it's so boring to hear these clichees
and it seems like the MJ fans don't want to face the fact he was a child molester, let it be blowjobs or whatever, that's not important. The pushing aside of it is pissing me off.

And I do see a similarity in some of his stage dresses and certain evil uniforms.
He was singing in a scary monster voice.

Plus, isn't there a difference between a white guy getting tanned and a black guy bleaching his skin? In the case of MJ I think he wanted to be part of the white ruling elite and on that way he was racist to his own people.

If you like the music, o.k., don't blame me for driving on the Autobahn.


"So fuck Doubleday Doran"
I don't like Michael Jackson's songs at all and I puke on pedophiles
but since this is still The Bukowski forum I'd like you to re-read his poem again.

Note: It's not my intention to post the poem to insult any single poster on the
subject of this thread because I do believe in freedom of speech.
My reason to post the poem is to show Bukowski's perspective on hatred.

What do you think of it?

The Genius Of The Crowd

there is enough treachery, hatred violence absurdity in the average
human being to supply any given army on any given day

and the best at murder are those who preach against it
and the best at hate are those who preach love
and the best at war finally are those who preach peace

those who preach god, need god
those who preach peace do not have peace
those who preach peace do not have love

beware the preachers
beware the knowers
beware those who are always reading books
beware those who either detest poverty
or are proud of it
beware those quick to praise
for they need praise in return
beware those who are quick to censor
they are afraid of what they do not know
beware those who seek constant crowds for
they are nothing alone
beware the average man the average woman
beware their love, their love is average
seeks average

but there is genius in their hatred
there is enough genius in their hatred to kill you
to kill anybody
not wanting solitude
not understanding solitude
they will attempt to destroy anything
that differs from their own
not being able to create art
they will not understand art
they will consider their failure as creators
only as a failure of the world
not being able to love fully
they will believe your love incomplete
and then they will hate you
and their hatred will be perfect

like a shining diamond
like a knife
like a mountain
like a tiger
like hemlock

their finest art

© Charles Bukowski

d gray

tried to do his best but could not
Founding member
uh oh - that means that those against pedo's are for them (shame on you), those who say they hate his music love it (double shame), and most sad and shocking is mjp really thinks he's a genius! we're all busted :D

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