The David Bowie Thread (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter roni
- Start date
i just never knew this clip existed - the bowie exhibit i saw last week had a section about this contest he won - the award and other stuff from bowie's archive regarding it.
i didn't realize the radio version we all know was a re-do. i almost like the original better.
i didn't realize the radio version we all know was a re-do. i almost like the original better.
mjp
Founding member
Yeah, his style and his music. When he came to America for the first time he was a folkie in bellbottoms and a floppy denim hat. He saw what was happening in New York, that the sands were shifting, and he changed up his game. It was a smart move for him, and if you look at his career he was usually taking on influences from someone or somewhere. A good example of that is the Bowie "Berlin" albums, which sound the way they do because he collaborating with Iggy Pop at the time.
In that way Bowie isn't unlike guys like David Byrne and Paul Simon who continually latched on to new things to keep themselves relevant. Not saying that's necessarily a bad thing, just that when you scratch the surface of some artists who are considered "fresh and original," you'll find more often than not that they are staying fresh and original by keeping their ears to the ground for whatever new things seems to be happening. That's smart, but I would argue that it's not necessarily groundbreaking, or even very creative.
And of course the New York scene influenced not only hippies like Bowie, but later of course the entire British punk movement, which was based lock stock and barrel on New York bands and style (via Malcolm McLaren). I know a lot of British punk aficionados don't like to admit that, but ask Chris Spedding - who produced the first Sex Pistols demos - what they said to him when they met for the first time; "Make us sound like the Ramones."
All of this has nothing to do with d gray discovering an early version of a Bowie song. But I typed it so I might as well post it.
In that way Bowie isn't unlike guys like David Byrne and Paul Simon who continually latched on to new things to keep themselves relevant. Not saying that's necessarily a bad thing, just that when you scratch the surface of some artists who are considered "fresh and original," you'll find more often than not that they are staying fresh and original by keeping their ears to the ground for whatever new things seems to be happening. That's smart, but I would argue that it's not necessarily groundbreaking, or even very creative.
And of course the New York scene influenced not only hippies like Bowie, but later of course the entire British punk movement, which was based lock stock and barrel on New York bands and style (via Malcolm McLaren). I know a lot of British punk aficionados don't like to admit that, but ask Chris Spedding - who produced the first Sex Pistols demos - what they said to him when they met for the first time; "Make us sound like the Ramones."
All of this has nothing to do with d gray discovering an early version of a Bowie song. But I typed it so I might as well post it.
can't get enough of this guy since i saw the exhibit.
here's some info about it - if it gets near you, don't miss it.
http://www.davidbowie.com/news/last-london-days-more-international-dates-david-bowie-51946
here's some info about it - if it gets near you, don't miss it.
http://www.davidbowie.com/news/last-london-days-more-international-dates-david-bowie-51946
can't complain here.
but will complain here:
These three albums don't have the slightest sound of Iggy. (Well maybe in the sense that he was buying some of the drugs back then.)
The whole sound of these albums - including the songs, not only the production - has the unmistakable imprint of Brian Eno.
Don't argue with me on that! I'd emerge myself as a terrible loser. Lawsuit-threatening and all.
mjp
Founding member
speaking of Bowie & Iggy and the passing of Lou Reed, has anyone read this? thoughts? I'm thinking about getting it.
Just found out:
Both, Iggy and David have covered songs of the French Chansonier Jaques Brel. <= see Links!!
Which reminds me of a friend of mine, who was acting and singing the role of Jaques Brel in a stage-play a few years ago. In the trailer to that show you can find Both of the songs, that Mr. Pop and Mr. Bowie have covered.
(and yes, the 'roni'-person that has put this trailer online [after filming und editing it] was me.)
Both, Iggy and David have covered songs of the French Chansonier Jaques Brel. <= see Links!!
Which reminds me of a friend of mine, who was acting and singing the role of Jaques Brel in a stage-play a few years ago. In the trailer to that show you can find Both of the songs, that Mr. Pop and Mr. Bowie have covered.
(and yes, the 'roni'-person that has put this trailer online [after filming und editing it] was me.)
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mjp
Founding member
Eww, paper?
Have not read that, but it looks interesting. Seems like that guy has written a lot of "unauthorized" biographies though, and that doesn't always bode well.
Scott Walker also covered Brel. I only know this because this cover was subsequently sampled by Orbital for The Naked and the Dead, which I happen to love ;)
Skygazer
And in the end...
After watching the Sweet video Short Bus posted in What are you... I thought it doesn't get much worse than that, then I remembered Bowie's The Laughing Gnome, here is a woodwind variation, there is a reference to Sooty in it, this was a kid's tv show (glove puppets) in the UK from the 50's to the 90's. When Sooty brought out his magic wand you had to shout at the tv Izzy Wizzy let's get Busy - sounds a bit pervy now really.
I watched about 2 minutes of the Brits last night (James Corden interviewing Pharell Williams and Nile Rogers). It was so cringeworthy I turned over.
Brand new Bowie.
A weird jazz freak out that would not seem out of place on Ornette Coleman's Crisis, Skies of America or Science Fiction and I absolutely love it. But probably not everyone will.
[This video is unavailable.]
A weird jazz freak out that would not seem out of place on Ornette Coleman's Crisis, Skies of America or Science Fiction and I absolutely love it. But probably not everyone will.
[This video is unavailable.]
Black Swan
Abord the Yorikke!
I find it interesting that most musicians, painters and writers turn to jazz, abstract art and simpler words as time goes.
mjp
Founding member
What?
my inner cynic would say he makes that type of music now cause he can't write any good pop/rock tunes anymore.
why wouldn't he if he could?
sorry to be negative ned, but i find it interesting that virtually all pop/rock - i.e. catchy melody - writers lose that ability at some point in their life, usually around middle age.
why wouldn't he if he could?
sorry to be negative ned, but i find it interesting that virtually all pop/rock - i.e. catchy melody - writers lose that ability at some point in their life, usually around middle age.
mjp
Founding member
Popular music is a young person's game, yes, but I'm not sure aging pop performers lose their ability as much as they lose their taste for the game. If you add fame to the mix, then you've got ego involved, and on top of that the desire to say something profound that can overcome the unsuspecting as they age.
But really, the history of popular music (and art and writing to a lesser extent) overwhelmingly suggests that creativity in general is short-lived. Very very few performers or bands are vital and interesting for more than two or three records. The proof of that is everywhere, in every genre and every era.
There are some stunning exceptions of course, and part of what makes them stunning is the fact that they are exceptions. Just changing your style every few years though does not a stunning exception make.
In an effort to stay on topic I just listened to the Bowie track and it's okay until the singer comes in. Which probably isn't a good sign when the singer has his name on the tune. But then Bowie's interest inirritating, atonal bullshit non-traditional pop singing is really nothing new.
But really, the history of popular music (and art and writing to a lesser extent) overwhelmingly suggests that creativity in general is short-lived. Very very few performers or bands are vital and interesting for more than two or three records. The proof of that is everywhere, in every genre and every era.
There are some stunning exceptions of course, and part of what makes them stunning is the fact that they are exceptions. Just changing your style every few years though does not a stunning exception make.
In an effort to stay on topic I just listened to the Bowie track and it's okay until the singer comes in. Which probably isn't a good sign when the singer has his name on the tune. But then Bowie's interest in
Black Swan
Abord the Yorikke!
Perhaps I'm not expressing myself very well but I stand by what I said, whether you are a painter, a musician or a writer. You develop a talent and experiment with it, you learn to play, to write or paint by looking at what's been done, reading others and listening to sounds. You finally need to break it down again to bits and use what is essential to you, which is most likely your own thing, your style.
mjp
Founding member
I agree.
But what you just said doesn't really have anything to do with jazz or abstract art specifically, while your other post was very specific. Which is why it made me go, huuuuh? The idea that every - or even most - creative types eventually turn to jazz and abstract art is too broad a brush. So to speak.
Those specific things are not everyone's ultimate destination, that's all I'm saying.
But what you just said doesn't really have anything to do with jazz or abstract art specifically, while your other post was very specific. Which is why it made me go, huuuuh? The idea that every - or even most - creative types eventually turn to jazz and abstract art is too broad a brush. So to speak.
Those specific things are not everyone's ultimate destination, that's all I'm saying.
Black Swan
Abord the Yorikke!
Perhaps not everyone's destination but I would be inclined to say that they are missing something. :D
Ageing in the internet age changes the game too. There was a time you made a record had the radio and toured. Jazz bands old and new had there festivals and clubs as did the lounge artists and Rockin round the clockers. The 60's artists and magazines from the 60's have benefitted from having more cash and more avenues to reach out to there fans who have also grown with them as has every generation since (how else do we explain Kiss and Motley Crue?) Like buknet like the 50 or so Greatful Dead sites there is a mass of Bowie fans interested in anything related to their (our) interest. And as long as there is interest there will be someone who says WOW!! didn't see that coming (recent Dylan stuff Keiths book)-or what a shame that sucked (insert Martin material or your own choice here)…until the next piece emerges from the artist- dead, alive or formally known as Prince.
I'm getting off topic but it will be interesting to see how aging artists and the curators of ageing artists make the shift to mobile device patrons. I think if you release shit people will just ignore it. If there is a museum for hair in Kansas and one for Louis Armstrong then there may be a real and virtual Bowie museum one day since it falls somewhere in between.
I'm getting off topic but it will be interesting to see how aging artists and the curators of ageing artists make the shift to mobile device patrons. I think if you release shit people will just ignore it. If there is a museum for hair in Kansas and one for Louis Armstrong then there may be a real and virtual Bowie museum one day since it falls somewhere in between.
I don't love that new Bowie track, but I like it well enough, which is why I'm glad there's a like button as opposed to a love button. Well pardon me, there is a love button, it's just that we don't have one readily accessible here. There's nothing really atonal about that track at all. The backbone is largely in Major keys, but the auditory complexity is the change from E Major to G Major. So it sounds more complicated than it is.
Bowie also treats these chords as IV chords rather than as I chords, which creates a sense of drifting in no defined key (in other words, the E Major chord is not I of E Major, it's IV of B Major and the G Major is not I of G Major, it's IV of D Major - this approaches changes the scale used to a Lydian mode - I'll leave it at that, unless you are truly interested in more). He also bases key aspects of the vocals on non-chord tones, which further assaults the ear to the point of wondering what's going on. We are used to hearing music lie naturally in a key, even as the keys change. In this one, his vocal confuses the ear through the selection of chordal (key) centers and note choices for the vocals.
I played along with it a few times and his vocal intonation is pretty much spot-on. Whether one likes this track and the jazz-like approach to both the instrumentation and the use of modes, is another story.
Bowie also treats these chords as IV chords rather than as I chords, which creates a sense of drifting in no defined key (in other words, the E Major chord is not I of E Major, it's IV of B Major and the G Major is not I of G Major, it's IV of D Major - this approaches changes the scale used to a Lydian mode - I'll leave it at that, unless you are truly interested in more). He also bases key aspects of the vocals on non-chord tones, which further assaults the ear to the point of wondering what's going on. We are used to hearing music lie naturally in a key, even as the keys change. In this one, his vocal confuses the ear through the selection of chordal (key) centers and note choices for the vocals.
I played along with it a few times and his vocal intonation is pretty much spot-on. Whether one likes this track and the jazz-like approach to both the instrumentation and the use of modes, is another story.
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And the B side...
Skygazer
And in the end...
Something to do on a Sunday morning perhaps, if you're a fan or you could just read his playlist at the bottom:
http://www.openculture.com/2015/07/david-bowie-becomes-a-dj-on-bbc-radio-in-1979.html
and from his 1977 album Low:
http://www.openculture.com/2015/07/david-bowie-becomes-a-dj-on-bbc-radio-in-1979.html
and from his 1977 album Low:
Digney in Burnaby
donkeys live a long time
I liked the link in the above open culture story to Johnny Rotten's 1977 radio dj stint. And his take on Bowie.
If you have 54 minutes there's this "literary diary" podcast by CBC radio host Eleanor Wachtel (her show is Writers and Company) on glam (with Bowie and others). It's actually good fun (baby baby we like your lips ;-) ):
http://www.cbc.ca/video/news/audioplayer.html?clipid=1524351249
If you have 54 minutes there's this "literary diary" podcast by CBC radio host Eleanor Wachtel (her show is Writers and Company) on glam (with Bowie and others). It's actually good fun (baby baby we like your lips ;-) ):
http://www.cbc.ca/video/news/audioplayer.html?clipid=1524351249
Skygazer
And in the end...
Open culture is a good website, you could spend a decade in there and not get bored - maybe.
Down the right hand side the Great lectures and Great Recordings I like a lot and the adverts are there but not too intrusive.
I will have a listen to the Lydon recording the now.
P.S I have 54 mins somewhere Digney:) - had a quick listen to the CBC show just now,will try to listen to it this week, thanks for that.
Down the right hand side the Great lectures and Great Recordings I like a lot and the adverts are there but not too intrusive.
I will have a listen to the Lydon recording the now.
P.S I have 54 mins somewhere Digney:) - had a quick listen to the CBC show just now,will try to listen to it this week, thanks for that.
For better or worse, Bowie trying to stay weird...,
PhillyDave
“The essential doesn't change.” Beckett
"trying to stay weird...,"
Trying? Nah. I think he naturally is. I do like his work tho.
Trying? Nah. I think he naturally is. I do like his work tho.
