Whatever you do - do not recommend Bukowski work to your boss (1 Viewer)

After being on downright spiral emotionally and spiritually my boss of many years turned toward the right wing extremism (he needed the blame assigned for his failures in life) and also strangely toward the eastern mysticism (Buddhism etc). I told him about Bukowski and the things he was writing about, were more in line of our daily troubles. I gave him short stories Hot water music and the movie Factotum.

I found them following Monday thrown in my locker. He never made comment, except that his wife hated the movie - it reminded her of her abusive alcoholic ex-husband.

Also I was assigned to work overtime on Saturday.


P.s. The Rush Limbaugh show is cranked even louder from his office computer.
 
Ha! I once had a girlfriend I lived with.. When it was over I was so disgusted with her, I just up'ed and left on Halloween night. I left a couple of Buk books there by accident. For some reason, prior to shipping all my stuff to my parents house she called and left me a message. Long story, short...she left a voicemail for me going on and on how she picked up and read through some of the books I left...She referred to all Buk books going on and on how he must have been a child molester, drunk, cheater etc and summed it up by telling me what a piece of shit I was for worshiping such a man! No wonder why our relationship failed she said! HAHAHAH!!!!

So yes, you couldn't pay me to introduce Buk to my boss, I wouldn't be punished with overtime, I'd be punished with unemployment probably!
 
In the '80s I worked for a printer and one of our regular publications was an insurance trade mag based out of Pasadena. I'd go out there a couple of times a month and wait for the editor to review the bluelines and artwork and would hang out in the reception area and read for an hour or two at a time. I'd gotten quite friendly with the receptionist who was about 22 and just gorgeous, sort of like a young, blonde Annette Bening (yes, way too good looking for the likes of me) but really sweet and not at all full of herself.

Anyway, she was going on vacation and asked me to recommend a book. I gave her a copy of Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas. When she got back from her vacation, she basically told me that she hated the book and after that would barely speak to me anymore.

And the moral of the story is... umm... I really have no idea. Just make one up.
 
I think she just drew the conclusion that I was some sort of deviant dope-fiend.

And I'm guessing, way after the fact, that she was a church-goin' good girl.
 
When I first moved to Oregon I was applying for a job in the marketing department of a lock manufacturing company, made it through three interviews, was supposed to start on Monday and had just one more interview to go -- supposedly just a formality -- to meet the big boss. He asked about my college degree, in English, somehow he got me to reveal that I write, then he asked what I write, poetry and fiction, about what? Oh, just life and stuff. He asked my favorite authors. I mentioned Bukowski, among others. I never got the call to come in on Monday, never got an answer to my questions about was I hired or not. Telling the boss I read Bukowski (or maybe that I write poetry) killed my chances for a job I desperately needed. It was a shitty job anyway...
 
You can't trust those namby-pamby queers, especially not with your shitty, minimum wage jobs. And those that write about life? Why, they're the most dangerous of all.
 
On spring 2008, I had an interview for a summer internship in the publishing house which publishes the french version of the Who's Who. Before the interview, I googled the name of the man I was going to meet. He looked like a forty-something austere guy and turned out to have an impressive career. That made me anxious. At the beginning of the interview, I was a bit nervous, he was testing me by asking me questions that were a bit unsettling, especially about the law studies I gave up. Some of my answers must have touched him : he softened up little by little, began considering me with benevolence and asked me more pleasant questions. When we came to my literary tastes, I told him that the author I was then reading at most was Bukowski. He was surprised and amused at the same time, laughed and began making some jokes. The atmosphere was then definitely relaxed, all my nervousness was gone and I myself laughed and joked with him. We happened to talk about many subjects I would have never imagined been addressed in an interview (imagine me talking about gymnastics with a middle-aged serious looking man while applying for an internship !). At the end, he informed me he had some other candidates to meet but he wouldn't meet them since I was the chosen one. I was elated (totally seduced by the guy) but I then had other interviews and finally preferred a house publishing more captivating stuff than Who's Who in France. :D

The most surrealist interview I've ever had. Partly thanks to Bukowski.
 
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"The most surrealist interview I've ever had. Partly thanks to Bukowski."


Maybe, but my view would be considered pretty 'sexist' and believe that to a middle aged man, good looking young intern would be a pretty exciting event - regardless who or what she's reading.
 
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Bukowski is becoming mainstream - that is what happens, the machine draws you in and makes you one of them.
 
Bukowski is becoming mainstream

Try mentioning his name to 100 people on the street and wait for the blank stares from most of them. Mention Stephen King, John Grisham, etc, etc and you will get "mainstream". I think that Bukowski is a great writer, but thinking that he is "Mainstream" is silly.

Bill
 
Try mentioning his name to 100 people on the street and wait for the blank stares from most of them. Mention Stephen King, John Grisham, etc, etc and you will get "mainstream". I think that Bukowski is a great writer, but thinking that he is "Mainstream" is silly.
That is me bospress - silly. I always defer to those of greater intelligence.
 
Bill Sikes - I think I might end up in a similar situation, if I recommended Buk to my boss.

Once, during a conversation about politics, he remarked "I don't care what anybody says - I love George Bush". There you go....
 
Bukowski is becoming mainstream - that is what happens, the machine draws you in and makes you one of them.
Who's being drawn in? A guy who died years ago? :confused:
Or do you mean he's becoming more popular? Even then it's all relative since, as others have pointed out, you could ask 100 people in the street and you'd be lucky if one or two even knew who Bukowski was, let alone had read any of his work. You seem to be implying he sold out in some way which is now a reason why his work has crossed over to the mainstream to an extent. Or have I misunderstood what you meant?
 
I believe his works are being drawn in to the mainstream. Yes he is dead, his works are in the Huntington Library I believe in San Marino which I am told is a very exclusive area. I understand Linda chose this place because she use to hang out there while he went to the races. He is being referred too more and more, movies, articles etc., from Stern to Moore. He recently had a reading at Vormans in Pasadena (little old ladies?). I also understand that at least one of his homes is now an historical landmark in Los Angeles (I could be wrong on this). Isn't that being drawn in when the toliet you took a shit on is revered? I took up a challenge about asking 100 people. I only asked 19, 4 knew of him and 1 had read some of his works. Not a random sample, just some people I knew. To me that isn't half bad and its just a start. I am going to ask some of my groups on the internet if they have ever heard of him. I think more people may have heard of Bukowski than you may think. Of course hearing and reading are very different things. Anyway I am new to this board and don't really know what I am doing and admit it so please forgive me if I have made a silly statement. At least silly statements give people something to post about.

And no I don't think he sold out -- but neither did Van Gogh
 
I believe his works are being drawn in to the mainstream. Yes he is dead, his works are in the Huntington Library I believe in San Marino which I am told is a very exclusive area.

I wouldn't really call San Marino "very exclusive," but mainstream or not, it makes sense that his works would be donated to an institution in a nicer part of town. Typically you don't have large libraries that house literary collections in the ghetto.
 
The ghetto is where real life happens so maybe they should have large libraries but they don't. I stand corrected. Thanks for the info.
 
library in the ghetto. ha. shit, shave and sell drugs between the stacks...
well, if real life happens in the ghetto, i guess i've yet to live. except that time i bought some drugs at the library...
 
A excellent library in the ghetto -- why not. Downtown LA has a great library. People who cannot afford day care drop their kids off there -- and it becomes a zoo. Buying drugs at a library? Sounds like your dealer wants to play it safe. Where do you keep your stasH? In the medical section.

Go down to your ghetto and live -- you still have time. Enjoy a block party. But make sure you are well armed and don't trust anybody. Bring some Thunderbird and make some friends.
 
Mentioning Bukowski to your boss? Some years ago I had my boss over for drinks and he saw my collection of tattered Bukowski books. I didn't get fired but my salary declined to the tune of 6,000 bucks a year. That was 5 years ago so I'm 30 large in the hole because of that German-American reprobate.
 
Well, I wonder who among us is really qualified to evaluate the ghetto and ghetto life...

I've seen things here in Chicago, but only as an observer. And yes, libraries are usually not a vital part of poor neighborhoods. Neither are well-maintained parks or regular street-sweeping. Public dollars only go so far...

But for the kid who rides the train and transfers to a bus downtown, this city is unlimited in free books available - much like any other big city.
 
I believe his works are being drawn in to the mainstream. Yes he is dead, his works are in the Huntington Library I believe in San Marino which I am told is a very exclusive area. I understand Linda chose this place because she use to hang out there while he went to the races. He is being referred too more and more, movies, articles etc., from Stern to Moore. He recently had a reading at Vormans in Pasadena (little old ladies?). I also understand that at least one of his homes is now an historical landmark in Los Angeles (I could be wrong on this). Isn't that being drawn in when the toliet you took a shit on is revered? I took up a challenge about asking 100 people. I only asked 19, 4 knew of him and 1 had read some of his works. Not a random sample, just some people I knew. To me that isn't half bad and its just a start. I am going to ask some of my groups on the internet if they have ever heard of him. I think more people may have heard of Bukowski than you may think. Of course hearing and reading are very different things. Anyway I am new to this board and don't really know what I am doing and admit it so please forgive me if I have made a silly statement. At least silly statements give people something to post about.

And no I don't think he sold out -- but neither did Van Gogh

I didn't think it was a stupid statement, I just wanted you to elaborate really, especially on the 'drawn in' comment as I wasn't quite sure what you meant. And we're all here (well, most of us) to discuss Buk (and other things) amongst like-minded folk. You make some good points to be fair and there is a difference between selling-out and simply becoming more mainstream. I think people can get too hung up on what is / isn't 'mainstream' anyway. Not saying you do, just in general.
 
Well, I wonder who among us is really qualified to evaluate the ghetto and ghetto life...
I am certainly not qualified to evaluate ghetto life, but I do some pro bono work for a non profit that has many homeless people. Some are totally out of it, on drugs, mental problems, etc. But some have a really rich background which suprised me when I first started doing some work with them about 7 years ago. Recently one homeless women challenged me to spend 5 days homeless in LA and see how I would do. I am seriously considering this challenge as I believe it would add a certain depth of knowledge to my background. I believe it takes one tough person to live on the street for any extended period of time and I want that enlightenment, I want to know how it feels. And I know that the ghetto and homeless are not interchangable, but I thought I would enlighten you as to my background.
 
...I want to know how it feels.
What are you, George Plimpton (look it up, kids)?

That's very noble I guess, but hitting the street for X number of days won't tell you anything about how it "feels." You will always know that it's temporary and in X days you will be sitting back on your couch with a big sandwich and a beer watching a Friends rerun. You will not feel any hopelessness or despair as a tourist. You have to lose everything and be there involuntarily to know how it feels.
 
Recently one homeless women challenged me to spend 5 days homeless in LA and see how I would do. I am seriously considering this challenge as I believe it would add a certain depth of knowledge to my background. I believe it takes one tough person to live on the street for any extended period of time and I want that enlightenment, I want to know how it feels.

You should have challenged her to live like a person with a job for 5 days. Just for laughs.

No but seriously, that's the gayest thing I've ever heard.
 
Thinking about it a little more, I think there must be a mixed attitude of the homeless toward the social workers, the soup kitcheneers, the change givers, the Salvation Army, the Red Cross, the YMCA.

Obviously there is gratitude but probably also they feel a sense of being condescended to. Most of them are probably very bitter, I don't know. I'm fortunate enough to have never literally been homeless but I would not crave the lifestyle even as a learning experience, or to fortify my soul or whatever. I doubt many of the actual homeless feel fortified, or educated. And what could you really learn from them anyway, in 5 days?

Some are complete assholes, some are prideless beggars, some are very meek and mind their own business, some are total raving lunatics.

No one knows what their world is like and it seems woefully arrogant to try to get in there unless you REALLY get in there, or have really been there, and NOT just as an 'experiment.'

If a homeless woman gave me that 5-day challenge though, I'd be very dubious about her motives for challenging me. Was she really trying to help me relate to her? Or was she just bitter and jaded and self-pitying and wanted me to rub my own face in my smug ignorance that I disguised as charity?

I'd probably go home and think about it.
 
OK - I hear you, pigmantoo. That would be a hell of a challenge to take up and it would probably be beneficial to do that. To get a taste of what those homeless clients of the non-profit go through.... wow - Gotta admit right now, I don't think I could.

Or I would take 5 days worth of food and supplies to an abandoned area within the city limits and just camp. With a couple of bodyguards. That would count, wouldn't it ? ;)
 
The transformed man

My posts are visible only to myself. I love it!

I think I'll call up Bukowski's former publisher (or maybe I should contact ECCO) and ask if I can publish some Buk stuff on cheap paper illustrated by talentless friends. When my proposal is refused, I'll post angry insults denouncing the arrogant protection of the Buk brand. Whee!

I'll also belittle any person or organisation that manages to embark upon a successful Buk-related activity, such as a Buk Bus Tour or getting his former dwelling landmarked.

I'm a bitter failed musician, artist and writer. I am TRANSFORMED!
 
There was a local member of Parliament where I live in the UK who, back in the 80s, spent two weeks living on state benefits, in council housing just to demonstrate that it was possible to eat well, save a little for a rainy day etc. He just came across as a patronising twat for reasons similar to the ones mjp mentions, i.e. it was a temporary arrangement and he would soon be back in his nice big cosy house. I'm sure you'd be doing it with the best intentions etc. but, personally, I'd stick to your very commendable voluntary work as that's actually doing some of these people some good. But hey, it's your decision ;)
 
What are you, George Plimpton (look it up, kids)?

That's very noble I guess, but hitting the street for X number of days won't tell you anything about how it "feels." You will always know that it's temporary and in X days you will be sitting back on your couch with a big sandwich and a beer watching a Friends rerun. You will not feel any hopelessness or despair as a tourist. You have to lose everything and be there involuntarily to know how it feels.
mjp -

Yes, it will be temporary, but I do believe I can feel something. I am interested in how others will relate to me like the police, business people walking to their jobs, etc and how will that make me feel. Sure, I will just be a tourist but don't tourists get a little bit of a feel of the country they visit?

My main focus is accepting a challenge that I believe will help me understand what my clients live everyday. I will have no money and no ID. Just me on the street. I have to figure out how the get shelter, food, etc. without getting killed.

George Plimpton - no, but maybe John Howard Griffin. And, no I am not going to write a book about it.

PS - I never watch Friends, nor have I experienced total despair, just major despair and have experienced hopelessness in that I had a child that died and I could do nothing to save her.

Thinking about it a little more, I think there must be a mixed attitude of the homeless toward the social workers, the soup kitcheneers, the change givers, the Salvation Army, the Red Cross, the YMCA.

Obviously there is gratitude but probably also they feel a sense of being condescended to. Most of them are probably very bitter, I don't know. I'm fortunate enough to have never literally been homeless but I would not crave the lifestyle even as a learning experience, or to fortify my soul or whatever. I doubt many of the actual homeless feel fortified, or educated. And what could you really learn from them anyway, in 5 days?

Some are complete assholes, some are prideless beggars, some are very meek and mind their own business, some are total raving lunatics.

No one knows what their world is like and it seems woefully arrogant to try to get in there unless you REALLY get in there, or have really been there, and NOT just as an 'experiment.'

If a homeless woman gave me that 5-day challenge though, I'd be very dubious about her motives for challenging me. Was she really trying to help me relate to her? Or was she just bitter and jaded and self-pitying and wanted me to rub my own face in my smug ignorance that I disguised as charity?

I'd probably go home and think about it.
I am a lawyer by profession and I work with the homeless (admittedly not all the time) to get government benefits they may be entitled, like SSI or SSDI, state programs, Medi-Cal, etc. You are right in that there is a mixed attitude by the homeless toward people that work in this area of social work. These attitudes range from total hate (and I mean total hate) to some begrudging acceptance. Most who I have worked with suffer from extreme drug addiction coupled with mental problems. They have backgrounds that vary from a Catholic Priest to engineer to business man to prostitute, to hard core criminal. Drug dealers really take advantage of them. On the 1st or the 3rd of each month (if the 1st or the 3rd are on week days) its fun to watch all the Cadillac Escalades show up on skid row. Gee, I wonder why?

The homeless woman that gave me that challenge is the mother of 8 children, most through rape or casual encounters. She suffers from extreme drug addiction, the heavy stuff, like meth, the big H, etc. She has been clean for about 9 months and her social worker was discussing a potential job, Cal-Works, Goodwill, etc. She first through out the challenge to her social worker then me because I was in the room at the time. She explained how difficult it was to even get to work, it you had a job and were homeless to say nothing of personal hygiene, etc.

I really have not seen much self-pity in them. They seem happy with their drugs. To many that's all they want. Give me my meth and leave me alone.
Woefully arrogant? Maybe I am, I really don't know at this point. I am not a do good'r. I can't do this in LA because to many people know me there, I was going to go to Santa Ana or some other close by area which admittedly may not be comparable to LA.

You should have challenged her to live like a person with a job for 5 days. Just for laughs.

No but seriously, that's the gayest thing I've ever heard.
Gayest thing you have heard? WFT are you talking about?

OK - I hear you, pigmantoo. That would be a hell of a challenge to take up and it would probably be beneficial to do that. To get a taste of what those homeless clients of the non-profit go through.... wow - Gotta admit right now, I don't think I could.

Or I would take 5 days worth of food and supplies to an abandoned area within the city limits and just camp. With a couple of bodyguards. That would count, wouldn't it ? ;)
Hey number6hourse,

That is my biggest concern, safety. On Skid Row, LA, there are lots and lots of assaults, some killings, etc.

There was a local member of Parliament where I live in the UK who, back in the 80s, spent two weeks living on state benefits, in council housing just to demonstrate that it was possible to eat well, save a little for a rainy day etc. He just came across as a patronising twat for reasons similar to the ones mjp mentions, i.e. it was a temporary arrangement and he would soon be back in his nice big cosy house. I'm sure you'd be doing it with the best intentions etc. but, personally, I'd stick to your very commendable voluntary work as that's actually doing some of these people some good. But hey, it's your decision ;)
Hi Bruno Dante -

You have stated is one of my biggest concerns, that is why I am not going to write about it, or even discuss it with any concerned parties. It is just going to be knowledge for myself kept to myself. I have always believed that it is not so important what you do as what you get done. I do a lot for these clients, but not much winds up as positive results - like staying clean, job, education, shelter, better future, etc. I just trying to figure out why.

Thanks for your post - spent some time in the UK and loved it. Hope to get back there this summer.
 
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Gayest thing you have heard? WFT are you talking about?

It's contrived. It's contrived as fuck and it's stupid, and I don't care to discuss it further.

It's nothing against you; it's the concept of the 5 day challenge. If I have to explain it then there's no point; the point is already lost and it doesn't matter.

You seem like a good guy. Have at it, if you like.
 

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